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Wednesday, March 6, 2013

Actual Noob PI Income Data and an Offer

[EDIT 11/11/13 - My friend Kao Jai asked I post this.
"With the upcoming changes to high security space Custom's Offices in the Rubicon expansion currently scheduled for implementation on November 19, 2013, I can no longer recommend PI in Empire space as a viable means of producing income. I must withdraw my offer of assistance to new bros. I am sorry. I myself am abandoning PI. I may even leave the game. I haven't decided yet. Regardless, I can not in good conscience continue to provide seed money and a NRP BPO to anyone. Good luck to you Mabrick! I hope everything RL turns out well. - Kao Jai"
And there you have it. High-sec PI is ruined as far as Kao Jai is concerned. It'll be a sad day indeed if he decides to leave New Eden.]

In my post from last Friday, Why be a Poor Noob?, I stated it was possible for a less than three month old new bro to earn half a billion ISK a month. Here is one of the comments from that post:
I think your estimate of income from PI is a bit high. If you are running 6 planets and getting 250000 R0/planet/day, then your total R0 production is 1.5m/day. After BIF conversion, that is 10000 P1/day. Then P2 at AIF: 625. Finally to P3 at AIF: 93.75 (for most P3s), or 62.5 (a few P3 goods require 3 P2 inputs). Robotics is a solid P3, selling for about 80k ISK. So assuming you make that, the income here is 7.5m per day. This is 52.5m ISK/week -- not shabby, but not quite the 100m you suggest. Still, a whole lot better than mining.  - Von Keigai
Let's bypass all the equations and what-ifs and go to the raw data. I turned Mabrick Mining and Manufacturing [MABMM] over to a good friend named Kao Jai. He started playing EVE Online last spring. He currently has just under 15 million SP. He had some RL stuff come up last year and didn't get to play a lot - just update training really.

When his play time resumed this year, he decided to try the Nanite Repair Paste (NRP) production I raved about while HBHI was in our C3. In fact, I contracted my NRP BPO over to him when HBHI joined Surely You're Joking and moved to the C6. He's the one who provided me the tax data for high-sec NRP production.

I went back to Kao Jai and asked if he'd turn over his first month's NRP production results. He agreed. Now I present those results to you. You be the judge of whether he did or did not make the sort of ISK to which I alluded in my post last Friday.

The player donation was from MABMM's other member for previous purchases. He's even more a noob than Kao Jai. Kao Jai also tells me he is racing to get Destroyers and Battle Cruisers to level V and all racial Cruisers to at least level III for the anticipated ship realignment this spring. In other words, he's had some expenses. But when is that ever not the case? So Kao Jai didn't quite earn half a billion ISK in his first month in the NRP business. But he got over 80% of the way there. He assures me he spent no more than 45 minutes a day doing PI related stuff. Is my claim vidicated?

I don't care. He's not a poor noob by any measure. There was something else Kao Jai and I discussed as well. It was because of this comment on Friday's post:
And you are asking a new player to pony up nearly 30mil ISK after flying without combat skills for 50 days? - splatus
Yes, you have to spend ISK to make ISK. That's a fact of business. And it's more like 50 mISK for a BPO and 30 mISK as start-up cost. It is a lot to ask a new bro to save. I have not forgotten how hard I worked to earn enough ISK for my first Hulk. It is hard work to be an industrialist. So here is the offer and I've talked Kao Jai into making it happen.

If you have less than 15 million skill points and want to give this a try, apply to MABMM. Kao Jai will require an API key for verification purposes, but once he accepts you into MABMM, you will receive a Nanite Repair Paste BPO and a 50 mISK grub stake to get you started. That's a 100 million ISK value that he will expect you to pay back after your first month.

Now you're asking yourself, "What's the catch?" Here it is. Kao Jai will send to me updates on who joins and how they do. If you take the ISK and run, we will advise any other corporation you try to join that you are a corporate thief and not to be trusted. If you do not repay the loan, Kao Jai will kick you from MABMM and I will make fun of you on this blog. If you take the grub stake and are successful, I will laud your accomplishment to all if you like. Or, I will leave you to prosper in obscurity if that is your wish. That's the only catch. Is that such a bad deal?

Fly Careful


  1. Invictra Atreides's blog is quite helpful for new player running PI in hs:

  2. Mabrick, I'm running your setup on my own, and plan on posting about it. I'm doing robotics, and the character running it only has relevant skills up to 4. I'm also doing this on 5 planets in high sec. Assuming your assumptions about 6 planets and level 5 skills, I will be happy if I net out to ~%75 of your production figures.

    First post about it here:

    1. Go you! Thanks for the link. I look forward to reading about your results.

  3. That's awesome. Good job all round and I look forward to readng of the adventures of the new PI boot camp.

  4. You can easily make 30m from the starter missions. (which you can run on 12 different planets, although you don't need to run that many) Use the 30m to set up PI chains. Sell enough of the NRP prerequisites to afford a BPO. buy the bpo. Profit.

    Your grubstake option would/will shorten the startup time, but it's easily doable solo with almost no skillpoints needed.

  5. Just chiming in with my 2cents worth. My PI operation also takes about 45 minutes a day, and nets me 1.3B a month... in Hisec. Just sayin'.

  6. Mabrick, you are comparing apples to ... apple pies here. NRP is manufactured. So there's a value add there that is not pure PI. The profit margin on NRP is low, but still something. The inputs for 10 NRP sell for 206000, whereas the output NRP gets 219000.

    So if my original assumptions are correct, you should not be getting anywhere this much output. Perhaps your planets have higher concentrations of stuff. These are highsec planets, right?

    In any case, regardless of the details, PI is great for anyone in EVE, newb or not. Congrats to Kao Jai.


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